Friday, December 07, 2018

Quote of the day 7th December 2018

"It seems that nothing like a majority of MPs are ready to be rational. The referendum might have been won on an anti-immigration message but the MPs forming" (Theresa May's) "majority are much more exercised by sovereignty, whether the place of Northern Ireland within the union or Britain’s unilateral ability to break free of the transitional arrangements.

"Diehard Remain MPs believe, on skimpy evidence, that a fresh referendum will result in a reversal of the decision.

"Diehard Leave MPs believe, on even skimpier evidence, that there is time to renegotiate a better deal (they argue among themselves what that better deal might look like) or that leaving without a deal would be just fine.

"Labour believes it can use the chaos either to take power or massively to improve its chances of taking power soon.

"Everyone is preparing to play ducks and drakes with the nation’s future rather than take the safe option."

(Alistair Meeks, from an article on the Political Betting site which you can read in full here.)


Jim said...

"The referendum might have been won on an anti-immigration message"

But its much more likely it was not. The EEC as was (which became the EU) was sold to the UK public as the "common market" it was sold as a trade deal. Brits never intended for it to become a political, soverign stealing monster, they never intended for the CAP, or CFP. It was sold as a trade deal.

Much has been stated about "anti immigration" but I dont think its there. Sure we should have control of our borders, but, i dont think that people from Spain, Germany or Poland are the problem there.

The bottom line is a political monster was sold to the UK public as a trade deal. Its a bit like PPI only a million times worse.

Chris Whiteside said...

the three main strands of the Leave campaign, in approximate order of prominence, were

1) We're sending a lot of money to the EU which would be better spent on our priorities such as the NHS.

2) We need to take back control of our borders to control immigration

3) We should take back control of our laws.

Theresa May has made a serious attempt to deliver on all three of those.

Jim said...

The one thing i remeber about the referendum was that the campaigns on both sides were utter rubbish.

I dont think many people voted the way they did due to influence from the official campaigns.

Chris Whiteside said...

I have more than a little sympathy with that view.

I've been arguing with Remainers on Twitter who argue that the result was invalid because they think that overspending by the Leave campaigns was the reason for the victory.

Apart from the fact that Remain was somehow allowed to spend £5 million or so more than Leave even after the Leave overspend, I thought that both campaigns were so egregiously awful that it's quite possible that if Leave had spent less money they might have won by more.

I would like to think that the main reason I eventually came off the fence on the Remain side after spending most of the campaign period as a floating voter was the three reasons I gave here at the time for thinking that a remain vote would be better for Britain.

However, on the emotional side, the Remain campaign was so bad it made me cross, and the Leave campaigns were so egregiously awful that they made me furious.

If I had voted on the basis of my emotions, and insofar as my emotions influenced my decision, the awfulness of the Leave campaign could have pushed me to vote Remain.

The relevance of what was said during the campaign, going back to my original point however, is that if Theresa May was guided during her negotiations with the EU to try to deliver what people voted for, what could she reasonably be expected to negotiate for than to try to deliver the things which Leave voters were promised - less money going to the EU, more money going to the NHS, less power in Britain for the European Court and control of our borders?

And her deal does deliver all those things.

Anonymous said...

Today we can just walk away from the EU, May's Noexit Brexit could leave us shackled to th EU indefinitely - that is not what was voted for.

Jim said...

The question on the paper was:

Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?

the 2 answers were

a. Remain a member of the European Union

b. Leave the European Union

option B won, where on the ballot does it mention FoM?, Where does it mention more to the NHS?

Where does it mention leaving the single market even? the answer is it quite simply does not